This is the rich dad radio show the good news and bad news about money. Here’S robert kiyosaki, hello, hello, hello, robert kiyosaki, the rich, dad radio show the good news and bad news about money, and today we have a very important show. As all of our shows are. This is about bitcoin, and it is why it is the most important currency ever invented in the world and for full disclosure. The rich dead company does not recommend any investments, even though i have bitcoin or real estate or gold or silver we’ll make recommendations. We’Re purely educational, and we want people to give different points of view. So today i you know a full disclosure. I i own bitcoin, and i understand why i do it, but i also own more gold and silver i’ve been in silver since 1964, when i was a kid and gold since 1972, when i was flying in vietnam and in my point of view, it’s not who’s Right or wrong goals over a bitcoin is just how much do you have and that’s what i that’s that’s my point of view on this whole thing, so we don’t recommendations on if you don’t like it, don’t touch it. So our guest today is excuse me. I mispronounced the name: it’s safe dean almost. Could you would you mind producing it because pronounce it because i just probably butchered it yeah? That was good enough. Safety almost is good enough in english. Okay, because you know, kiyosaki gets butchered like crazy, you know. So that’s uh, just call me safe, safe, is good enough. So anyway you’re the uh he’s the author of the bitcoin standard, the decentralized alternative to central banking, which i agree with hundred percent, and he is the best selling groundbreaking. It is the best groundbreaking study and of the economics of bitcoin and so um. You know this thing of the reason i own gold. I started with gold and silver when i was 16 in silver and then 22 in gold was, i don’t trust the banks. It’S pure and simple, you know the fed and the us treasury, because i study that stuff i was i was i flunked out of school, but i do know about the fed. I do know about the treasury they’re two different people they’re supposed to be, but today they’re one they’re called janet yellen secretary of the treasury, who was head of the fed and what’s safe, safe is talking about here is exactly the reason you should be in bitcoin. Also, gold and silver, because isn’t that true i mean i don’t know if you follow american politics but when joe biden just said he’s going to put janet yellen as secretary of the treasury and she was head of the fed federal reserve bank. That’S communism! That’S hardcore! Communism, that’s centralized government, so i think what biden has done is made our cases for gold, silver and bitcoin valid so safe. What sefedeen? What what? What? What caused you to write the bitcoin standard and the decentralized alternative to centralized communism? I mean centralized banking um yeah. I think that’s a very astute observation if you think economically what uh, what really was the uh beating heart of the communist? Well, i should say the dead heart of the dead communist economy. Corpse uh was the goss bank, the communist bank, which essentially was one bank in the soviet union, and everybody had an account at the gos bank and it seems that uh, the us and other countries seem to be headed in that direction. Um and it’s not. I don’t think the biden victory is uh is necessarily what’s taking us there. It may be accelerating the process, but i think you know the process of heading in that direction of everybody getting in their bank in the their uh central bank. Getting their account at the central bank is um is, is increasingly likely and um. You know it seems not. Even the banking system is able to stop this um, but i think the one alternative that is going to be offered the one alternative that is available is uh bitcoin, and that is the subtitle of my book. The bitcoin standards, the decentralized alternative to central banking, and i think, um, whatever use whatever you uh, whether you like bitcoin or not. You have to admit that it is the only working alternative that exists today for central banking, essentially because central banking is has a monopoly. On providing the currency and it has a monopoly on international uh correspondence, banking or transferring money from one country to the other, both of those two things have to be done through central banks until bitcoin came along and offered us one alternative. So really it’s the only decentralized and only alternative to that uh process, and this and um that’s the one very important aspect of bitcoin hang on. One second use a very powerful word in there. It’S called only yeah, so you would dump all gold and silver and real estate and all well gold, gold and silver. Are you know that they’re uh substitutes for the monetary function and that they have a sub money supply that is not determined by a central bank but they’re, unfortunately, no substitute for international uh payments? That’S the uh sad reality. There’S no gold banking! You can’t use your gold to pay internationally. You can’t ship gold and there’s no gold settlement in clearance. Wait, wait, wait! Stop! I can so. Please be careful because i’ve been doing this when i was a kid yeah. Well, you know. This is what you and i were getting into, is: why do you bitcoin guys have to dump on gold and silver, and why do gold and silver guys have to dump on bitcoin? I don’t understand you think gold and silver is the enemy. When really it’s communism, no, i wasn’t dumping on them. I was saying they they’re not using only because there’s other ways, i’m a lot older than you and there are ways. Yes, there are ways, but you know there’s no way to make payments uh, no matter what you do in terms of um, just there’s, no gold bank, you can’t you that you can’t make a payment buy something online with with physical gold that gets shipped from the Country to where you’re buying it you can use it yourself, you can store it, you can, you know, buy it and sell it, you can gift it. Okay, be careful you’re using the word only you might. You might not be the smartest guy in the world because those guys who are smarter than you and because we we’ve lived longer, we’ve done things differently. So just be careful. I just don’t know why you guys get into this pissing match. I’M i’m really not like. If you look at my book, the first seven chapters are essentially all about gold, mostly about gold. It’S all about gold, and i am a gold bug. I’M still, you know at heart. I still love gold and i don’t get into those pissing matches with the gold bugs, in fact, i’m usually one of one of the people. That’S trying to mend the bridges between the two i’m i’m gon na put i’m gon na put you and pewter chef on the same show and then we’ll see who’s really the most neutral we’ve i’ve. I’Ve had a debate with peter schiff. You can google it um. It’S it’s on youtube. There’S me and uh peter ship we’ve been and we’ve had a debate. Once you can see uh the perspectives, i’m not anti-gold. I think gold is good. It’S just the problem with gold is that you can’t make an international banking payment system work around gold since 1914, because the bank of england and the central bank of the united states have essentially monopolized that trade, and i would just speak, bitcoin gets around it. How is this your words only and you can’t those are called absolutes: it’s been a century of people trying to build a payment system around gold and failing and it gets captured by government, and that’s because that’s really. The crux of the point of my book is that bitcoin um improves on gold’s monetary policy but, more importantly, bitcoin improves on gold in the fact that it’s much harder for governments to capture it and co-opt it well, we’ll see we’ll see yeah, you know. Look. I don’t disagree with you, i’m just cautioning, you say you’re, a young man, not that young, no you’re you’re using those absolutes. You know i that’s true. I i never do this. I will always do that. You know i mean you know, that’s true, because you’re a human being and as as my as an old guy, what we know is your opinion can fail, but the markets never do and in the future, we’ll find out if you’re, right or not, but right now, Just be careful, you know that that’s like jim rogers, one is a friend of mine for years and years and years and he’s hiding in singapore. Now, when i ask him, why he’s hiding there, he has his reasons. You know: that’s that’s why, but he doesn’t make. He doesn’t make me wrong for living in arizona. He lives in singapore. He says: well, singapore is the only place in the world to live and basic. That’S what golden bitcoin guys get into. The other thing is that what roger says that, which i agree with he says you piss off the government with bitcoin they’ll step on you, and i do agree with that. So you guys keep saying well we’re going to take on the the government of america. The centralized banks of america, they will step on you, they have guns, big guns and i’m an ex-marine, i’m a former marine. So i understand what it’s like to enforce the monetary system, so i’m just cautioning you what i’d rather get into is this is why are you? Why are you so? What are the advantages of bitcoin? For somebody like ryden, who has none, you know you can get into a pissing match with peter schiff and uh rogers, but it doesn’t do any good unless you really man. I i it’s entertaining to me, but i want to know what i why you think bitcoin is going to go to the moon. You don’t have to make gold and silver wrong. So i’m trying to say no, it’s uh, i i i’m again, i’m not trying to um. You know, i’m not trying to be very absolutist about i’m. Just trying to uh distinguish the value proposition, which is that in the case of bitcoin, the clearance of bitcoin is performed using uh software and hardware – that’s uh relatively very cheap. So you need a few hundred dollars to have equipment that can run the bitcoin network and actually, probably you could do it for less than uh a hundred dollars as well, but why? Why would i bother you know? Well, why why you know you said it there’s communism coming, you don’t want to explore all the other options that are out there. You might give it a chance. Okay for full disclosure. I own bitcoin, okay, yeah. I also own more gold and silver that problem takes care of itself, usually because your bitcoin eventually appreciates more than your silver. It happens to most people who try to you sit there with that with that arrogant, young man’s cocky attitude and you’re gon na get your ass stomped on, because i had my ass stomped on because i had the same stupid attitude. I’M just trying to say this. Okay, i’m asking this question which nobody’s ever answered me: nobody has the reason i like gold and silver. I’Ve started gold mines and silver mines, so there’s bitcoin mines. Okay. Now that takes a lot of work. Just it’s probably a 20-year process to start a gold mine and the gold mine. I started out of toronto. Canada tsa the toronto stock exchange the chinese government took from me, so you may understand now why i don’t like doing business with the chinese, but my solar mine out of argentina is smoking along. You know i was producing silver at a dollar an ounce and today it’s about 22, an ounce and all that so i’m doing. Okay plus i made money selling the shares of the stock and all this stuff. So i’m doing okay. The question you guys have never answered for me is: why can’t somebody else just produce their own bitcoin if, if the equipment is so cheap, why not just make my own yeah? Now thousands of people have produced thousands of other uh bitcoins, but none of them can work on the bitcoin network. I don’t know what you think. I i i don’t see you guys get into those absolutes look if it’s all no. This is an absolute because it’s cryptography, like you know, i understand somebody with bitcoin. Why can’t? Why can’t i just it’s not like a gold mine, it’s not a physical gold thing, it’s just it’s! It’S basically code! So why can’t yeah? Well, and – and you know, the gold is basically atoms in a sense, but we give it value. If you, if you think about economics, economics is in the minds of people. If you study the austrian school value is subjective, we give things value. So we decide that this yellow shiny method is very valuable. We decide that the silver shiny metal is a little less valuable, but also quite valuable, and we also can decide that digital tokens that can clear payments and clear uh messages with payments on a network that has uh wide acceptability around the world. That has high level of reliability in in in the fidelity of its transactions. We can also decide to give that value. There’S no difference, it doesn’t have to be material. You know there are a lot of things that are immaterial that have value so you’re saying it’s. The acceptance and the network of bitcoin that gives us its value and specifically there are reasons why it is the network of bitcoin and it’s not just because it’s a first mover advantage or it’s because it’s the biggest network and specifically because the bitcoin network is the Only network that has grown from day, one almost independently, not controlled by anybody and and and grown according to the rules of the protocol, not according to somebody running the protocol, the guy who made it disappeared. I understand that, but why couldn’t i start my own with my little apple mac computer? How can you start your own and my name is just code. You can start it, but you can’t start it and not be in charge of it. That’S the problem. How do you start one that you don’t control? That’S the tricky part, so bitcoin had a lucky set of circumstances where the guy who made it disappeared for whatever reason, and then it continued to operate without anybody in charge and the protocol continued to grow and all the people who tried to take control of it Have failed repeatedly, which suggests that there’s a lot of inertia and a lot of sclerosis in the network, which means that the main consensus parameters of the network should be around for a while. So i just heard: there’s a guy in tahiti who has another bitcoin yeah good for him. You know there are people who, in the 90s claim to have a better internet and uh. I’Ve called them tahiti, but they have apple apple computers, [ Laughter, ] yeah. Well, hey, hey! I really are asking my questions to you because they hey look. I have traveled the world looking for gold and silver. You know i was in peru and i was standing at 14 000 feet. The mine was up at 17 000 feet and i’m standing there and there’s little holes in the ground going up the mountain, and i stand there talking to the mining engineer. You know canadian mining engineer. I said what else little holes. He says there are little mines. I said when he says probably five hundred years ago and i said see mean the inca, the peruvians or the indians were looking for gold way back. Then there were miners back then, before there was internet before there was television before there was airline travel before there were shifts before the spaniards came, but they intuitively knew about gold and that and that’s so every time i talked to you guys, i said: well, you Cannot break bitcoin, i go well. You know, i don’t know about that. So that’s why i’m asked i’m sincerely asking you the question: why couldn’t i sit here with my little thousand dollar macbook and start my own little mine and produce my little coins? You can uh, try and mine on the bitcoin networks, just you can go and try and mine gold with your own hands. But you know there are better ways for you to make gold, which is you know, write books and make your beautiful and great shows and then you’re able to make money from that. And then you can buy your gold. It’S just a more efficient way of doing it. It’S the same thing with bitcoin. You can mine your own bitcoin. You can do it with your laptop but you’re just going to waste electricity and make very, very, very, very few coins from it. Okay, so okay, i mean uh, i you know i got the same answer and i get the same. The same arrogance for all you bitcoin guys. I just don’t get it. You know, because i’m really not trying to be again. I’M sorry anyway, i’m just doing my best right now, because i really want the answers from mwah, because i’ve started my own minds. I’Ve seen thousand-year-old minds, you know, i’ve seen them and and human beings are something inherent in the human nature. So you’re not talking to some idiot who buys gold at a gold store going more into this uh. Really. I appreciate your smiling and candor, but i’m i’m sincere in my questioning, because i really would like to know because i have started gold mines and silver mines and oil wells and i’ve all produced a lot of money. But i just want – and i own i own bitcoin – i’m very happy with it and all this, but i would just like our readers to know our listeners to know why bitcoin is as valuable as it is and what what are the chinks you know, how could How could it be cracked? That’S what i want to know. So we come back to the name. Is safety, dean and amus and you’re a great support man we’ll be right back. Thank you. Welcome back barbecue psychology, radio show the good news and bad news about money. Once again, you killed us to the rich dad radio to rich dad radio program anytime anywhere on itunes or android and youtube as long as they don’t take us off the list, because we say stupid things and all of our programs are archived at richdadradio.com, because repetition Is how we learn? So if you listen to the program, a second or third time, you’ll learn even more because you learn more by listening to it again. I do it all the time, but, most importantly, you have friends, family members or business associates. The reason we archive it at rich dad radio.com is so that you can listen. Your friends and your family can listen to in business associates and then discuss it, because that’s how we really learn. We don’t we don’t sit there in a classroom. Just listening to some idiot school teacher tell us about life when they don’t even live, so our guest today is safidan amus is that is safideen almost yeah and uh. He is the author of the bitcoin standard. You know all of his friends said you got to get this guy on the show, because this guy really knows what he’s talking about, and i agree he does, and the bitcoin standard of the book is a decentralized alternative to central banking and he is the best-selling Groundbreaking he is the best-selling groundbreaking study of the economics of bitcoin, so we we just got into pissing on each other’s legs with like peter schiff does, and all these guys do. I just don’t understand it, but why gold sucks and why silver sucks and all this i just want to know about bitcoin, and we were talking about it because you call them [, __, ] coins and so describe in precise economic terms. What is a [ __, ] coin? Basically, the term [ __ ] coin has been mentioned in congress. Now it’s in the congressional record after uh representative warren davidson mentioned it uh last year and it’s uh the definition i would venture for it. I think a lot of people agree with this. A [, __ ] coin is a form of money. That uh has somebody at the top of it, who can just make more of it at the at their will, and so anything that has somebody in charge. Who can make more of it is a [ __, ] coin and so that there are, i think, five or six thousand [ __ ] coins that are digital, that copy bitcoins uh code in certain ways and do the same thing that bitcoin does. But they have a guy in charge or a group of people in charge all of them and essentially those people can change the supply at any point in time. Someone asked this question, so it wasn’t the code i’ve mentioned. The bitcoin was, i think i love about. Bitcoin was this: as his price went up or his value went up, its volume went down, whereas the us dollar by your definition, is [ __, ] coin, because as the vault as the value of the dollar comes down, as volume goes up, they print more of It yep exactly, but you understand, that’s why i like gold and silver also is because i trust a [ __ ] coin called the us dollar. Absolutely that’s exactly the point that i make in my book. The first seven chapters of my book are to make this point that the most important thing in money is the stock to flow ratio. It’S the ratio of the existing stockpile of the existing supply to the flow to the new production and things that have a high stock to flow have always historically been money. And historically, the thing that has had the highest stock to flow is gold, and second place is silver. Bitcoin is different because its stock to flow now is going to overtake gold’s stock to flow it’s going to become higher than gold over the next few years, and then and and and that’s why i own it. But i’m asking this question so why can’t the question was we had these things called icos initial coin offerings and all that are those shut coins? These are [ __ ] coins; yes, absolutely they’re. Definitely [ __ ] coins, all the icos, all the other coins other than bitcoin. They are [ __ ] coins because all of them um, you know whatever you think about the technology and the things that they’re doing. There’S a group of people behind them. Who could get together and change the supply quite easily with bitcoin? We know for a fact that this is very, very, very difficult to happen, and i would like to tell anybody who thinks that it can happen. You know to go ahead and try and do it, because we’ve had we’ve had a a a concentrated cartel, essentially of the most significant businesses in bitcoin, along with some of the most important developers in bitcoin and a lot of people with a lot of bitcoin get Together a couple of years ago, and try and change the code behind bitcoin to change one small parameter in the code of bitcoin, not even change the supply and they couldn’t do it. None of the other coins have that the us dollar doesn’t have that. You know. There’S people in charge of the us dollar, who can make an endless amount of it and that’s why it too, and all national currencies in my opinion, are [ __ ] coins, so yeah. I understand that so um. Are you saying it’s almost impossible for somebody to write a code alongside bitcoin’s code or duplicate the court, but call it um josquin? It is possible, you can do it, but good luck with doing it and getting the market to value that as if it is bitcoin. So it’s as, if you know if the zimbabwe and central bank prints more dollars, that’s not going to devalue the us dollars. People can tell the difference just because they’re both called dollars, that’s different, and so all these other coins. If you look at their charts, you know over five years, uh all of them end up basically flatlining against bitcoin. They tend towards zero and continue to collect more zeros next to the decimal point, as they tend toward absolute zero and zero liquidity. I i understand that because when in my when i was starting off in gold, you know they said: what’s the definition of a gold miner, that’s definitional. Gold miners is a liar standing next to a hole in the ground. So i understand you know there was a lot of fakes out there and the reason i love bitcoin and all this is because i think the u.s a dollar is criminal. What they’re doing the centralized bank? You know the fed and the treasury. They just keep printing more of it to solve our problems, so this is my op and that’s the reason i have gold, silver and bitcoin is because the fed in the us dollar and, in my opinion, all fiat currencies with the euro, the yen and the peso – Is they’re they’re [, __, ] currencies i mean, would you agree you’re not going to get any argument from me about that? I don’t know that so my question is, then: if the fed and centralized banks come up with centralized coins, what’s your opinion on that because that’s why i’m asking that’s why i talked to guys like you: what do you think’s gon na happen? I think um people think that this is competition for bitcoin, but in my mind it’s advertisement for bitcoin. This is just them telling you what is uh, really valuable about bitcoin that hey, you know, sign up. Take our currency where the supply is up to us. We determine it at any point in time and we can always give anybody as many as we want, and you get no say in the supply, and you can’t even know how many there are and also we get to figure out all the transactions done by you And we can you know if we don’t like your facebook posts, you don’t get to eat for a month, [ Laughter ]. I like your attitude anyways. So so, if if, if uh, you know janet yellen was treasury and she might mean she was fed and she, if biden stays in she’ll become treasury, which is communism when the treasury and the fed are one, that’s centralized government. So, are you saying that if, if biden came out with the biden coin, you’ll be a [ __ ] coin yeah i mean we already have something very similar, which is the dollar? I mean people think these central bank, digital currencies are going to be a big deal, they’re really not very different from the current currencies because they are, after all, centralized and their supply is run by the gov by the central bank and the government. You know that so it’s just more consolidation of power and i think the the dangerous thing. What you’re saying is they can’t do it? The fed cannot do it on the treasury. The government can’t do it. I think they can uh. They can produce uh [ __ ] coin, but they cannot produce something that competes with bitcoin right. They can’t they can’t, because you know the whole point of having a central bank is that you want to control the money supply and you want to give the government control over payment clearance and bitcoin takes those two things away from government and puts them in code. Bitcoin is just using software to replace all of that stuff, and so, if you use software to replace that it’s just a far more efficient way of doing it, and that’s ultimately why i remain optimistic about bitcoin, because it’s not a competitor, it’s not it’s! Not a company, that’s out there saying hey we’re going to put the us government central bank out of business and offer software solutions instead of it. It’S not uber! There’S no ceo! It’S a software solution. It’S an open source software solution that anybody can adopt. I i understand that i just want to, but that’s why i own it. The other thing, too, is a complaint which took me a while to get over was it in 17 2017 that bitcoin hit 20k, i think and around there yeah and it crashed down to what three three hundred or something to three thousand three thousand and then, when I talked to uh guys like ralph powell and all that who other guys who know about the bitcoin phenomenon. They say what happened in 2017 was there was no money behind bitcoin. He says in 2020, there’s money behind of it now and rael paul says: there’s a wall of money behind it. Now, yes, and also you know robert you’re, a mining guy, so you should um you’ll appreciate this. The bitcoin supply the mining of bitcoin, currently uh, happens at a rate of 900 coins a day up until may this year. It used to happen uh at 1800 coins a day four years before that it was three thousand six hundred and then before that, the four years before that was uh, seven thousand two hundred so every four years the new supply of bitcoin drops by half yeah. So this is my my question to you, okay, so every next question is so: let’s take us down to the 21 million coin. That’S it. How does it? How does 21? How do 21 million coins supply the world economy with money? It’S it’s not a problem. There’S the the the supply of money is, does not matter. Money is a good. What matters is it’s purchasing power and you can fit infinite purchasing power into each bitcoin, so each bitcoin is divisible into 100 million satoshi’s, and you know the way that bitcoin solves this problem is the same way that bitcoin scales is the same way that bitcoin can Take on more value, it’s what we like to call the number go up: technology as the price of bitcoin rises, the volume of bitcoin trades rises and the amount of money that bitcoin holds rises and the value of each satoshi rises, and it becomes a bigger market. You don’t need more money, you don’t need inflation, you don’t need the supply to increase, in fact. So so i’m asking this question okay, because this is where i’m really stupid on this whole thing. So let’s say: bitcoin hits a hundred thousand, which uh max kaiser says it will next week or something. How does a person making 15 bucks an hour afford a hundred thousand dollar bitcoin? You know you don’t need a whole bitcoin, there’s only 21 million. The vast majority of people would never get to own one whole bitcoin. You can slice and dice a bitcoin just like the dollar slices and dices down to a penny. Yes, and but a bitcoin is sliced down, you know dollars 100 pennies. A bitcoin is 100 million. Satoshi’S, so we can keep slicing down. You know in in several years it’s just going to be unheard of for most people to think about owning a whole bitcoin uh, because the whole bitcoin will be something like you know, think about the 400 ounce gold bar. That’S what one bitcoin is is like, so you don’t have to own a whole one in order to use gold. You know you can buy a tiny little gold coin right so anyway, this is making a little bit more sense and the other thing i heard you know, because that’s what i’m going to clear with you, because i just hear i mean i’m, i’m constantly on youtube. Listening to all you black jobs, who are bitcoin fanatics out there, no i like it, then i have to listen to shift in my other year, [ Laughter ], it’s just entertainment to me, but i still buy the crap out of it. You know, and it’s somewhere along the line. You know i don’t really i mean i make enough money, i don’t really care, you know i just get richer and richer and richer. I just i sit there going what the hell is going to happen. You know i mean you guys going to you guys are going to change the world. If you can really solve this problem of fake money, i call it. I wrote a book called fake, fake money, fake teachers, fake assets and that’s the and i own silver and gold, and now absolutely okay. You know actually my my next book uh, which i’m working on right now, which you can subscribe to. If you go to my website safedean.com, it’s called the fiat standard. It is the sequel to the bitcoin standard and it’s about essentially that the fiat world, the world of fiat food, which is fake food, fiat, family, fiat everything, um, the fake money, just creates a fake world around it, because it allows uh the people who create new Money from nowhere to to bestow economic value on things that are worthless and that just disturbs the entire process of economic calculation and economic planning for everybody else. This is my question to you. Okay, one of the reasons i don’t like gold and silver etfs they’re fake yeah. I i really don’t know if there’s really gold or silver behind of it, and now i’m hearing more and more that bitcoin guys are coming up with fake bitcoin or paper bitcoin like an etf or something like coin. Is that happening um? Potentially, i i mean i don’t know um of any particular, so i can’t really say it is happening um, but i would assume it might be happening somewhere or the other. However, bitcoin is uh, bitcoin really uh. It is a verification technology. If you want to understand what bitcoin does it’s just a process of meticulous, astoundingly, complicated, uh verification where everybody’s verifying everything yeah, specifically verification? So the way that you join the network is that you verify what everybody else is doing every 10 minutes. Everyone checks, everybody else’s balances and everybody checks to make sure that all the coins are in order and the ownership is in the with the person who or with the address that um that should have them so you’re constantly verifying the supply anytime. You go on the bitcoin network. You can check exactly how many coins there are and you can find out where and how they’re distributed, but so it is really the but aren’t some people now offering. If, if i give them, my bitcoin they’ll pay me interest for it well, yeah. So what happens now is there? So you can own your own bitcoin. If you get your own, if you own your private keys, then you have your own bitcoins on the network, and that is the equivalent of holding your own physical bars of gold with your own hands. You know you verify them. You verify the purity you put them through the most expensive, sophisticated spectrometer and you verify them and you hold them, and you know they’re yours, that’s what it is to own your own bitcoins, but if you go towards some of the um other solutions. Well, in that case, you don’t own your bitcoins, you own a claim on the bitcoins that are held by the etf or by the well there’s no bitcoin etf, but there’s isn’t that something that shut coin again, yeah well yeah, which is why you know most bitcoiners, Will tell you you should hold your own private keys or you know. If it’s not your keys, it’s not your bitcoin. You have an um you. You have a essentially a promise from somebody that tells you they will give pay you back your uh, but isn’t the same thing. They did with gold and the dollar fake dollars and yeah absolutely. But, but if you but bitcoin essentially offers you the solution where um you can verify for yourself and you can take ownership of your own cones yourself in a way that you can’t do with gold, i i could well, but you need, you need a giant spectrometer To verify that no no no people will i can. I can buy a [ __, ] etf, which i don’t. I don’t trust. I don’t trust you you know, but how do you trust physical gold? How, if you were to go out and buy a million dollars of physical gold, you know, how are you going to verify that this is actual gold? You’Re gon na need several tens of thousands of dollars worth of equipment. I’M a miner! I have all that stuff. Trust me: yes, you are a miner, you have a lot of stuff, but bitcoin allows the equivalent stuff in bitcoin is worth a couple hundred dollars. I want to know why are guys going to fake bitcoin now and they’re, offering me interest on my bitcoin yeah they’re, probably lending it out um they’re at fractional reserves, in my opinion, so i would not uh. I would not want to get into that, but that was i just wanted your opinion on it. You know that oh yeah, i would not get into it. I would not recommend it and also, you know i think um, but it doesn’t harm you as a bitcoiner, because i understand as long as you control the physical. Yes exactly, but also you know with yeah with fiat money. If somebody does that you’re you’re affected, even if you’re, not part of the bank, because your central bank is going to have to bail them out with bitcoin, if this happens, this blows up, there’s a short squeeze on bitcoin. The value of your bitcoin goes up. I understand i just i just get pitched all the time they said you know give us your bitcoin i’ll pay, you interest for it, because you got you got no interest on it. Well, it’s the same thing. They say about gold, there’s no interest on gold. So well, i don’t need interest, you know, but people who do will do will get sucked into what i call the fractional reserve fiat currency trap and that that’s my that’s what i want to talk to you about one last thing: okay. I also heard because bitcoin, let’s say bitcoin goes to half a million dollars a coin – that it’s only going to be used for major purposes like businesses and stuff like that, whereas the satoshis will be for trading independently. Would you say that’s true? I mean that’s just uh, that’s just a matter of units um, i think yeah for most things, because one bitcoin is 100 million satoshi’s, so um. If bitcoin is worth say, a million dollars. You know it’s not every day that you’re going to be denominating transactions in bitcoin you’re, not going to quote your lunch in uh 0.00037 bitcoin you’re just going to use. So the reason i you know i’m bullish on bitcoin is because of all everything you’ve said, but also i don’t mean – and i don’t trust the dollar at all, but you know i’ve been buying it. I didn’t buy it at 3. 000, i’m buying it. 9. 000. I’M doing pretty good, i have a lot of it. You know, but eventually it’s going to allow me to make major purchases that i wouldn’t have been able to do. Had i saved 9 000 us dollars right, i mean isn’t that kind of the yeah exactly. I think it’s uh the way that it’s evolving if it continues to work the same way just because it is harder money is that people whose value is parked in the heart of money will appreciate and people whose value is parked in the easier money will depreciate. So, essentially, we’re going to see the dollar-based economy, uh uh shrink as a part of the pie in bitcoin grow as a part of the point. Currently bitcoin is like point 0.2.3 percent of the global money supply. So it’s still a little um. Well, not a drop in a bucket drop in a cup uh, but it could grow. You know if it uh if it grows further. It just becomes a more significant part of that cup and who knows, maybe it becomes the whole cup one day yeah. So i want to have you back on as this thing progresses and all that uh, let me give you s-a-i-f-e-d-e-a-n.com yep this book. His book is the bitcoin standard, the decentralized alternative to centralized banking. So i i thank you for being a good sport and we’ll have you and peter chef on next week. Thank you very much. Thank you. So much
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